Full Transcription: Healing Through Meditation, Mindfulness & Bodywork Therapy

Janelle: You're listening to, "Staying in the Game," a Plum Dragon Herbs podcast where we have conversations about mindset and techniques for staying at the top of your game. I'm your host Janelle Leatherwood. Joining us today is Jason Lage, a therapeutic massage, bodywork, and reflexology practitioner whose goal is to revitalize health and lessen pain and stress for his clients. He is the owner of "Tranquil Heart Enterprises," and practices in the Minnesota area. Welcome to our podcast, Jason. It's so great to have you here today, and I would love for you to introduce yourself to our listeners today.


Jason: Hi, everyone. My name is Jason Lage, and I'm a board-certified therapeutic massage and bodyworker and a reflexologist. And so that's...and I have my own business and live with two beagles and have three children that are all grown up and going to college. One of them, however, is actually not in college. He's a special needs individual. He's a genius with autism.


Janelle: Oh, tell me more about that.


Jason: Okay. So yes, his diagnosis is pervasive developmental disorder. And what's interesting is he's nonverbal, so he doesn't speak. However, he is vastly intelligent. And what's interesting is he was born in 1996, and he's kind of the reason that I am here to this day. Not entirely, but definitely a huge, huge credit to him, not just for teaching me about humanity, but about sensitivities. Because he is an autistic individual, again, for example, his speech and communications abilities are not developed with his neurological conditions.


But other aspects have been heightened and that's what indirectly occurs. So there might be areas or portions of the brain that are developed as somebody even 10 or 20 years older than him. And it was his sensitivity, because he's a regular client of mine, and believe it or not, we literally have a conversation through bodywork. It's body language. It's energy and these things. And, literally, we can fill in each other's sentences as we are connected through this work.


Janelle: That's really fascinating. So tell me what is bodywork?


Jason: Okay. So bodywork is, and again, so I'll do my best to define this. Again, it is a summary of the work which is corresponding to principles of alignment as well as energy, okay? So whereas a manual therapy modality would be like effleurage where you're applying a long stroke, okay? Whereas bodywork deals with the body being, whether it's manipulated or lengthened or even the individual relaxing into a place where his body is in a optimal alignment. So, again, so, for example, of this talking through the process, okay? There is a point on the top...


Janelle: If I walked in and I said, "Okay, I wanna have you do this bodywork on me." I'd come in, lay down, or what would I do as a client of yours?


Jason: Yes. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So you would come in... And, again, so what we would do is I would probably begin working on your neck and shoulders and things like that because, again, the manual therapies lend themselves to bodywork because the muscle and fibrous tissues, okay? Especially the fascia, the fibrous tissue, that connective tissue, it actually resists when pressure is applied to it. Even a light pressure, like, 1 ounce of pressure, it will initially resist that, okay?


However, if pressure held for the right amount of time, with the right amount of pressure, at the right angle into the resistance, if you will, of this fascia, then it will actually release, okay? Or it'll accept you into the tissues. And this is very, very important because, again, if your tissues are not allowing the structures of your body...and this is how I can summarize what that bodywork session would be is think of it like this.


The majority of us are, you know, I'm doing the quotation fingers here, we're powering through the day, and we perceive as though we are supposed to be holding ourselves up in space by our muscles and our fascia. But that is a misconception because the muscles and fascia actually drapes on the hard structures, the bones of the body, and it is the ropes and pulleys, this dynamic tension that's created called tensegrity, that actually holds us upright in alignment and things.


So  is a way to dissolve the inefficient, the excessive and deficient tensions in the body that are either emotional patterns or belief systems that are no longer useful, and are actually causing compensation and usage patterns, okay? Because even though we're quite all different in how we're built, there is an optimal way for which all of our bodies are integrated and how they work together. And bodywork actually is a way to get that so that...yes, yes.


Janelle: Is the technique that you use, is it like a firm pressure or very light pressure touch? What is it like?


Jason: Yes, yes. So it is that entire range from very, very light pressure all the way down to deep. And, again, so let's take one step back because this conversation is kind of heading in a direction that defines what massage therapy is today. And that is useful for our conversation because the business that I created, Tranquil Heart Enterprise, I find myself different from other corporate massage venues in that I don't run a protocol, I actually listen to a person's body, and then I work on them.


So I address what their body tells me to do. But to take one step back to address the modalities, okay? The periosteum is our fibrous tissue that surrounds the surface of our bones. So that is our fascial layer covering all the bones of our body's surface, okay? So when I do deep tissue work, or I'm working deeply with the body, I'm working all the way to the periosteum, but no further because it doesn't get any deeper than that, okay?


But from a fascial perspective because, again, you can imagine that...so imagine this...and this will be interesting for you, I think, to wrap your mind around in that... So, again, subconsciously, we...our brain will resist a movement because it is protecting itself. It's a protective mechanism. So in other words, if the shoulder even, you know, if it's supposed to just drop down and correspond with what gravity is, it won't necessarily do that say, if there is impingement on a nerve or something.


That's a bad example because, obviously, you wouldn't want to impinge the nerve further. But in the example like our clavicle, or underneath the arm into the axial or where we have those lymphatic nodes, those portals for drainage of the cellular byproduct in our body. We want that open so that those blockages can drain and that thing can...and all of that...all of that gunk can be then excreted from the body.


So, again, we would want to open up and expand that and do so gently where we're actually...where we're not resisting. We're not pushing or pulling, but rather, we are a quality in traditional Chinese medicine called "sung", S-U-N-G, which you can think of as, how do you make a pizza? You don't overcook it, and you don't undercook it. It's just right. So now I'm going to take it a step further. And here's a question for you, even though it's rhetorical here.


So how is it that we discover that excessive tensions or tensions existing in our body that we're not even aware we're holding on to? Yes, the answer is stillness. It is actually listening to that internal environment, as well as that external environment and then... And, again, it's softening and sinking. Think of energy like 7UP bubbles on top of the Soda settling down on top of the soda. You can't force those bubbles to sink any faster. They have to sink just like the silt settling to the bottom of the river. And that is precisely what Lao Tzu meant in the Tao Te Ching when he said, "Let it be still and gradually it becomes clear."


Janelle: Okay. That's really interesting. So how do you figure out what's happening in that internal environment as well?


Jason: Yes, it's because I have developed a sensitivity to the energy. In fact, I can literally touch the surface of the skin, and I can feel that slight oscillation. So it is...so be very sensitive. A developed sensitivity to energy as well as to tension. And I can feel when there is that blockage occurring or if there's some stuckness there. It's as if my attention to my intention will literally just, yeah, I just I feel it. And that's through listening. Think of...well, that's an interesting...I think you'll find this interesting. Power is sensitivity, okay? Yes and with great power comes great responsibility, doesn't it?


Janelle: Yeah. So it's a gift that you have really.


Jason: So no, no. It's a gift that you have as well. I simply have had a very fortunate experience to have some mentors that I trusted and who unconditionally loved me. And so I listened to what they said, and I practiced, practiced, practiced as well as... Like I said, I would say the majority of individual will be like," Oh, you have a special needs son. How is that a blessing?" But believe me, it absolutely is. It absolutely is in every way, and that's very interesting as well.


Janelle: Oh, I believe that. Absolutely. Absolutely. Tell me how does your son communicate back to you then?


Jason: So, again... So he would, he does have vocalizations, so it would be, like, vowel sounds A, E, I, O, and U expressed as a vocalization. So, let's say that I am working...let's take reflexology, which is one of the...reflexology is not bodywork, okay? I'm gonna take one second here to define what reflexology is. And that is that it's based on zone therapy, which was created by Dr. Fitzgerald, okay? And zone therapy is...there are nerve pathways running vertically throughout the body, five on the left and five on the right.


And zone one starting in the insides of our feet, like our big toes running all the way up to the top of our head, and then working outward laterally, okay? So what he had discovered... Now, he was an ear, nose... Dr. Fitzgerald was an ear, nose and throat doctor, and he had discovered that by applying constant pressure to a reflex, it had an anesthetic effect throughout the entire nerve pathway. And so he was actually doing surgeries just by applying constant pressure to the reflex.


You have a physiotherapist named Eunice Ingham, and she, basically, was who had disseminated reflexology. Created a medical protocol of working systematically, in a very specific way, these reflexes on the body to affect the entire body, all the glands, and quadrants, all the organs of the body, just by applying a systematic pressure with a technique applied with the hands to the bottoms of the hands and feet. And so when I'm working say, for example, I will pick on my son here, through usage, again, we're talking about an individual who can get himself really wound up quite well.


But he doesn't know how to unwind himself, okay? And I'm meaning something very specifically, obviously, by unwinding. Because, again, we're talking about these holding patterns with our body, whether they're sociological or there's pain that occurred once, perhaps there was even acute pain. Maybe there was a laceration. But then after that, it became associated where he was just holding on and protecting that particular area. And that is what led to the dysfunctional movement, okay? So what that manifests as in the reflex is, like, a congestion, okay? It's a tenderness is what he feels.


So when I'm working through this denoted congestion, he'll look at me and he'll be like...and we'll both will just be looking at each other and be like, "Whoa." We have words like, "Ooh, Chihuahua," and things like that. "I've discovered that ooh, Chihuahua here on your foot, Mr. Dillon," and so on and so forth. So, again, we have an interesting conversation with regards to working through and negotiating the disbursement of this tension and congestion.


Janelle: Wow, that's really fascinating. 


Jason: Thank you. Thank you.


Janelle: So now, if you want to apply the same principles of the bodywork to daily living, is there anything that you can glean from the work that you do to help people who maybe aren't gonna go in for bodywork. They don't even do massage regularly. But what are some, like, practices that they could do at home? Like, can they incorporate meditation or stretching or self-massage? What... I don't know, do you have any ideas there?


Jason: Yes, that's an excellent question. Absolutely. So meditation as an extraordinary pathway to healing, okay? Because you're turning your attention inward to listen to your body and integrate with your mind so that you are experiencing yourself. In meditation and mindfulness curriculum, a working definition is coming to terms with things as they are.


So just like you said, a self-care technique, whether it's yoga or in myself, Tai Chi has been instrumental in... Because here's the thing, and this is what I missed. We were just on the line here with Josh Walker, who's a martial artist and things like that, and he asked me a couple of questions in regards to this. And there is a world of difference between external and internal martial arts. External being, like, kung fu, pick any style of external kung fu or Shotokan karate. The internal being Tai Chi and Xing Yi and Ba Gua, okay? But the...so the external, you're training the external forces. You're...the sinews of your hand and all of that, whereas the internal martial arts, you're cultivating your Chi. And instead of external force, you're actually internal energy and cultivation and you can't...


So tension for internal, even though that's...even when we're standing here, okay, or sitting in our chairs, there's still a dynamic level of tension because they are contractual tissues. These muscles. However, again, it's like we were talking about Tai Chi will teach you how to balance those tissues, and that meditation can lead you to be calibrating that tension. So, for example, if you think about, like, right now if you turn your attention to your legs, you might be over tensing your legs right now. And it is your mind that you will actually be, "We've found the wheelhouse now. Who's steering the ship, okay?"


And that could be even just a very basic self-care method for individuals within themselves to say, "Wow, you know, I'm really holding on here." And this is where I like to throw a Zen proverb, and that is, "Let go or be dragged." Okay. Excellent. Excellent. Yeah, so...and here's another one for everyone that would wish to embark on this path. Another Zen proverb is, "If you're facing in the right direction, all you have to do is keep walking." Yeah.


Janelle: Yeah, that's good.


Jason: Thank you. It's not mine. 


Janelle: So this meditation and these practices, do they help the person get unstuck with, like, whatever energy has harmed them or stayed with them, like, negative energy that has...?


Jason: Yes, precisely. Yes, we're on the same page. And this was actually my answer for Josh. I was getting to this point. We were talking about how Tai Chi, being a very philosophical art, how have I used the principles of it to influence my practice. And, again, so anything that I say here will be a reflection of what I've learned from my mentors and teachers. All of this is just...you know, this is a reflection on them. And so differentiation as an example here. Differentiation is a term even in physical therapy that we use to describe something called "sensory motor amnesia."


And, again, what this would be, these are those holding usage protective patterns, the negative energy that we're holding in our body, where we're holding on to these things. And mind/body disciplines and martial arts, and all of the external and the internal. Because at the end of the day, and this is what I was talking with Josh about, whether it's jujitsu, mixed martial arts or Tai Chi Chuan, okay? I know Tai Chi gets the reputation of being, you know, a slow-moving, healthful, you know, and things like that.


But back in the day, you know, those martial artists had to use it to survive. And so we don't...oftentimes it will take an individual, you know, decades and decades and decades to develop a skill with the principles of Tai Chi. And so, therefore, it's really discredited as opposed to just learning some technique to kick someone in the groin, for example.


But all of these, the principles remain the same. So we could say that all martial arts are the same even though the principles are what we're referring to. Because, again, the principles of alignment in bodywork discipline, such as the Alexander Technique, are the same as the principles in Tai Chi as they are in praying mantis kung fu. So all of these principles remain the same, and it is precisely through that body knowledge, which is a process again.


So you would be dissolving the encumbered attachments that we are withholding in order to liberate ourselves, and actually get back to what we knew prior to about six or seven years old. Because it's right around this six or seven years old where, again, I heard a gentleman, a podcast, he described it beautifully. He was calling, "We're all unique." And he referred to this as our weirdness.


And it is our weirdness that we celebrate when we're young like that around six or seven, and then somebody says, "Hey, quit being weird." And really you're stuck in your own...just being yourself and you're like, "Oh, I'm not gonna be weird anymore. I better disconnect myself from myself." And then you go on, of course, to seek approval. And how do you get that? Well, you start behaving like somebody else. So now you're behaving like somebody else, molding yourself, and disconnecting yourself from yourself, okay? And that is, again, so the beginning, usually in these dysfunctional or sociological...maybe you saw Uncle Bob or something moving in a certain way, you know, and remain in your head. And these things then manifest. 


Because you have to remember, traditional Chinese medicine or, you know, in traditional Chinese medicine, when we talk about Chi, you will develop the expression of your Chi, and by that I mean genes, okay? So we will develop the genes based on these lifestyle choices, which kind of defines what holistic health care is, is all of the issues stem from the root, which is that lifestyle. So...


Janelle: Yeah, I see what you're saying. So helping people understand the root cause of their problem. What are some, like, daily practices or regimens that you recommend to your clients or patients on a regular basis, other than getting bodywork done?


Jason: Yes. Okay. So that would be to sweat every day, okay?


Janelle: Okay. That's great. 


Jason: Yes, exactly. Precisely it. What I mean by that is, obviously, exercise is a key component in wellness, okay? But that gets a bit...even though what I noticed right now, what's kind of trending and what a lot of individuals are saying with the future of healthcare is exercise, and exercise fitness, and health care. This kind of unified thing.


And I feel like they're missing the boat because a lot of the clients, you know, a lot of my clients come to me after having been subjected to those processes, even working with a personal trainer. Because what happens when you take a tension that you're not already aware that you're holding on to that's in an excessive point and then adding additional tension to it?


Janelle: It causes injury, I'm guessing.


Jason: Precisely, precisely, precisely, no bueno. And so, again, so sweating though does not necessarily...there's other ways. Even far-infrared sauna. There's yoga as a wonderful... And, again, when I say yoga, people may perceive that, like, that is not inherently dangerous. It all is...and everything has limitations. So another thing I mentioned to Josh is that everything has limitations.


I wanna go so far even psychotherapy, okay? Even therapeutic massage and bodywork and reflexology. The solution and this is Jack Horn [SP], so these aren't my words. "The solution is consciousness, okay? And a deeply therapeutic relationship with another individual." So, again, so in those moments if I make that connection, and I am that person that is making progress, which can be even one half of 1%, okay? Then I may persuade an individual to sweat every day.


Another one, okay, is counting calories. Everyone says, "Ugh, counting calories." Again, here's the difference between Tai Chi philosophy, and the philosophy of contemporary society is we want to drive through...you drive around the building with the golden arches and get our healthcare handed to us in two minutes at the window. It doesn't work that way. So just as an example of counting the calories is finding out what that calorie amount is for each individual.


And then, you know, if somebody wanted to be losing weight, for example, we are in an obese society and there's just all these misperceptions. A lot of foods that don't even make you feel full and these kinds of things. And all of these people are not even aware of. They might be being misled by marketing and these kinds of things. So if they wanted to lose weight, they could just take that number of calories and consume 200 or 300 less, you know. And no matter what, they're gonna lose weight. It's gonna happen. So another thing is H2O, okay? Very simple. You're not sick, you're thirsty. Okay.


Chronic dehydration. Many of the issues that deal with chronic pain and things like that are just because we're all walking around chronically dehydrated. Everyone's body weight divided in half as the minimum amount of simply water that everyone should be drinking. If they want to save their health insurance policy down the road, just drink the minimum amount of water, you know what I mean? 


That in and of itself, again, with the weight loss, all of these things, the energy in the bodies, all these things will start coming full circle and it becomes...This was great. The misconception is, here's the truth Janelle, is that it does feel great to be alive. It does. And the last thing I would just mention is it's so very important to assume to be better or just to be okay. It's never too late. You know, and when we assume something is neuroplasticity. So we assume somebody. It's just like saying, "I'm going to get better about this." And you say that to yourself every day, you assume that that is going to happen. And it will, eventually, solidify in your consciousness. It works.


Janelle: Absolutely. So that's the growth mindset right there versus a fixed mindset.


Jason: Precisely. In order to grow, you have to cross a boundary of limitation as a visual there.


Janelle: So would you say that's your mindset right there, or do you describe your mindset in any other way?


Jason: Why I mentioned there's no downside to thinking positively, the moment is all that we truly can affect. We've also discussed that and life, and that's Tai Chi or bodywork and massage. People think, "Well, it's about maintenance," and yes, they are right. It is about each and every day we are maintaining this because here's another Tai Chi concept for you, Janelle, is that it's not a light switch.


We don't say, "Oh, I'm Tai Chi mode now." No, no, no, this is always 24/7 endlessly the form of the formless and embodying this integration, okay? But the point of life is not maintenance. There's a lovely quote, and I love this, and it says, "A ship is always safe in the harbor. But ships aren't meant to stay in port," you see. And so that's the point is that life is adventure. It is about throttling those RPMs, okay? Getting those RPMs at a higher velocity, that's what life really is. But it is precisely that maintenance and consistency that puts you...that positions you luck being when opportunity meets preparation, where you can then live your life fully.


Janelle: Yeah. So just to kind of summarize what you're saying, there's no downside, like you said, to thinking positively. And we shouldn't look at life as we're just trying to maintain. It's a whole life philosophy, and we're gonna try and integrate it into all areas of our life and really see change happen.


Jason: So you are absolutely right. It is mindfulness. So every moment of every day we can live with awareness is what I'm trying to say. And that really is what Tai Chi is, is being aware of that internal world, and what it is communicating to you, simultaneously with the external world. So the Yin and Yang, and they are not opposites. Do you notice I caught myself there, too. I did it again.


As I said, Yin and Yang. And because I'm American, and I assure you it is not Yin and Yang. It is Yin Yang. They are complimentative. They are complimentatives, and there's a bit of each in each other. They are not... But that is something that we like to do over here in the West is we like to divisionalize. We like to partition things. Just like I said, we like to deduce things to their fundamental parts. But it's not that way in life. So, yes, yes.


Janelle: Okay. We have to look at the whole picture.


Jason: Yes, yes. The little and the big picture. Simultaneously you see it there. That's an excellent... So the details only in so much as they would affect that bigger picture that you're referring to please. 


Janelle: Okay, that's a good correction. Yeah, I like that because we have to look in the details and at the big picture is what you're saying. Yes.


Jason: Can I add something else, too, here? 


Janelle: Absolutely. 


Jason: You were just...and I'm looking over my notes here. My experience, because you asked me about my cumulative experience, what I have learned? And this is my opinion, okay? But as somebody who has worked for a while now, years, and years, and years in this work, and dealing with energy, Chi if you will, okay? That the source, what I've come to understand is the source of this Chi is either benevolent or we could say holy. And that is because she doesn't like to be... like, it doesn't like to be restrained.


My Sensei put it to me wonderfully a couple of weeks ago. If we think of a fishing wheel because we don't hold that energy like we're energy hoarders. Some people are email hoarders, I heard that, but we don't try to hoard that energy in because energy can stagnate. That's what they mean by Yi dau Chi dau in traditional Chinese medicine. Where the mind goes, the energy goes. Where the energy goes, the blood follows. And we don't want these things to stagnate.


Think of that fishing wheel. So we can let it go. We can send it back into the universe. There will be a supply of energy coming back through those channels, okay? Yes. One additional thing is change is not painful. It is our resistance to change that is painful. That ties in with everything we just talked about. And then this one is Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming and I love what he had said when he said, "The taller the bamboo tree grows, the deeper it bows." And I just feel as though, again, our higher centers as human beings, you know, it is a higher center when we choose to slay our ego, okay? However, then, again, here's an opinionated American coming straight at saying, "Let's do this, you know. Let's slay that ego." You know. Yes.


Janelle: Yeah. It does take a lot of humility I feel like to see change happen because you have to admit to yourself that there are things that you can improve on. There are things that are good just the way you are, but there are things that you can work on. And if you don't mind, I wanted to talk to you about some of the changes that you've seen with your patients?


Jason: I have a couple of not so fun examples that I'd like to chat about. And, again, it's a...so the first one though, and this is where Plum Dragon Herbs has helped my clients tremendously, so this is an excellent opportunity to tie them in, weaning them from naproxen. Even myself as a manual therapist, okay? So the attrition on my joints is tremendous. It's unavoidable even with absolutely astute body mechanics, okay? So yes, so taking inflammation out. I was taking ibuprofen.


This is years and years ago, and I was taking that to kind of to take the edge off some of the attrition that was occurring with my tendons and my joints and things like that. And then I said to myself, "You know, I'm just gonna quit this right now because I'm not really doing the things. It's just holding it kind of the same. I just wanna find out." What was interesting was that it was, like, 72 hours or so, a little bit later, and I started discovering that the pain that I was feeling was not even the pain at all. So that stuff...yes, precisely.


So it was completely distorting my perceptions of even what was truthfully going on, okay? Okay. So now I have a client here who chronic, you know, who takes naproxen every day because he has autoimmune disorders. So, obviously, that causes just things neurologically and stress, and these things lead, you know, the manifestations of tensions in the neck and the cervicals, the shoulders. And at, like, the short tendon of our [inaudible 00:37:48], just above our elbow. So many of us are holding that at right angles just because of these postural...this daily usage. And so then during the inflammatory process, okay? The fascia comes through, which is three dimensional and continuous. It lays itself down in a spider web. You know what I mean?


Janelle: Yeah.


Jason: But it does so haphazardly because it attaches to this gland and this tendon over here and that's what we call this adhesion. Things are sticking together as opposed to flowing freely of one another, which would allow blood flow and Chi and all these things, right? Yes, yes. So now we have a perfect storm for congestion blah blah blah. Let's get back to Dit Dat Jow here. So it was though I had phased in some Herbal Ice Liniment. And this was an herbal form of ice because ice is very effective and it feels nice, okay?


However, eventually, if you consistently use ice, it will stagnate that Chi, okay? And so then, again, now what you're doing is you're trapping that Chi within those meridians, and you're not progressing that condition. You need to get that Chi flowing. And that herbal ice, as an herbal equivalent to ice, to remove that inflammation from the tissues, it was...actually relieves in an herbal form. And that was fantastic especially when we consider it as a segue, a catalyst to removing somebody from over the counter pharmaceutical anti-inflammatories. Extraordinary because those...naproxen, that will destroy your kidneys. And I know it's a bold statement, but this stuff isn't good, okay?


Janelle: Yeah, that's incredible. I really like Herbal Ice. That's one that I like to keep with me in my backpack and take it when my kids and I are hiking. Yeah, it's really great because...and you can't keep ice around anyways. And as, like, one of our blog posts is titled "Ice is not so Nice." As you said, it can lead to stagnation, and it doesn't help the healing process. It just feels good, and that's why we do it.


Jason: And cool to hear that you're hiking with your kids. That's awesome to hear that you're all out getting active...


Janelle: Yeah, I guess it'll be ski season now. 


Jason: Oh, fantastic. Excellent. So let me jump over here to another client case here. So now, we're going to talk about an 80-year-old male, okay? A Thoreau scholar, Henry David Thoreau scholar. Anyways. Yes. So not that that's pertinent, but just this is a vastly intelligent person who has been a part of the mainstream medical establishment for 80 years. So, you know, it's not his first rodeo, so to speak.


And he was referred to me by a Virginia orthopedic physician who was aware of what it was that, you know, my work and things like that. But because of the encroachment and all these different medical specialties that ping pong individuals around before they will make a referral to somebody like myself after they can't help them, or that they just wanna send them back out, you know? Yes. Okay. So, again, this individual was diagnosed with dystonia, which is a spasm in his neck muscle. It's similar to Parkinson's, but it's not Parkinson's, okay? So it's this chronic neck spasm that's occurring.


Well, he goes to the medical specialists and what did they do? "Well, for your dystonia, let's give you muscle relaxers." So yeah, so he went home. He took one muscle relaxer. He fell out of bed and broke his foot. So now how does this digress the process? Is my question. And that's completely rhetorical. But the fact remains that the stress, and the frustration, and the tension that was surmounting, coupled with anxiety, and where there's anxiety usually there's depression and things like that, which is outside of my...you know, what I mean.


But therapeutic massage and bodywork and reflexology is very beneficial for this because, again, what we can do is help facilitate that parasympathetic response. Just that rest and digest where you can actually feel warm and cozy and pump the brakes and just allow that heaviness, and softness, and sinking to occur to gain some clarity and resolve for your attention and your intention, and the expectations, and the belief, okay? So it's all these things.


Anyways, within a couple of sessions, again, I believe their testimonial when they first did come to me was they weren't even sure whether they were gonna make it in a couple of weeks, right? And then a few sessions with me, and again applying combinations of ancestors and Ho family, Dit Da Jow to that neck area in order to heat things up, have that analgesic effect, and then cool things off with that herbal liniment. Again, we're on demand. We're doing awesome.


Janelle: Oh, that is great. 


Jason: Yes. Yes. 


Janelle: That's great. Well, I'm excited that you've seen those results with Plum Dragons Herbal analgesics. And Dit Da Jow is the term that has been used for ages and particularly in martial arts. So we're talking about herbs that have been soaked in an alcohol base, and have been soaking for many months and becoming potent. 


And they contain these bioactive compounds that when you apply them topically to the skin, will enter the skin tissues, and into the cellular level even, and can do amazing things like promote healing and also help take away pain. But not just the symptoms of pain, but get to the root cause of it. And so as I'm talking about herbs, I'm just wondering at what point in your studies did you get introduced to herbs? And how did the world of Chinese herbal medicine infiltrate into your practice?


Jason: Yes. Oh, how appropriately placed because that is precisely what the Dit Da Jow does is it penetrates deeply into the tissues. So for myself, again, I had forgotten about Dit Da Jow. The first time I was ever exposed to that, of course, was growing up and watching "The Karate Kid" when, you know, when Daniel-san had that on this bruise, and then Mr. Miyagi made that horrible compress, you know what I mean? To take the bruising out of that kicking injuries, and it had wonderful effects to that bruising tissue.


So that, of course, was in my mind, and then, of course, the term came about over my martial arts just over the, you know...especially with regards to full contact martial arts and things like that. I mean, I've seen some contusions that were downright traumatic. And, yes...and so...but I forgot completely about that because, again, as a massage therapist, I use essential oil. These hydrocarbons, you know, like Frankincense, for example, adding oxygen to the bloodstream just like think of our Chi and energy as the amount of oxygen in our blood, okay? So essential oils, all of this is quite great. And I was treating superficially with wintergreen and... Let's see here. Oh, just other essential oils, okay? They're still just like Biofreeze.


Now, they will penetrate deep into your tissues just like Biofreeze or Cryoderm, okay? Hot or cold. It's simply superficially giving you relief, whereas the Dit Da Jow is going to penetrate deeply into those tissues and take that inflammation out, okay? 


Janelle: Yeah.


Jason: And that's a different song. Like I said, I was literally in what...I mean, just a chronic, chronic inflammatory process with my right wrist. And it was a combination of taking Wise Mender with Gecko tonic, as well as our Ancestor's Dit Da Jow from Plum Dragon and their herbal ice that completely 100% recovery from what would have led some individuals to even get out of the industry. 


I, of course, again, I knew that there was a way out of that process, however, I didn't know what. And so I started doing an inquiry and I was, like, "Hey, I forgot about Dit Da Jow." Researched it. Tried a couple of brands. And because of the classy site that Lisa Ball created, that you folks have created, that seduced me to wish to trust you, okay? And you did not let me down.


Janelle. Oh, good.


Jason: So the testament to the quality. Well, like I said, we wouldn't be having this conversation if your guy's product did not speak for you. But after all, Biofreeze, topical ibuprofen, okay? Because you can get...an individual can go to their physician. There are topical ibuprofen and I do also advocate that people talk to their physicians about this because they don't necessarily have to be ingesting this ibuprofen if that's what they're getting relief from. 


They can get a prescription for something else. But, you know, whether they're paying out of pocket for things like that, they should definitely consider Plum Dragon Herbs and Dit Da Jow because now we are talking about still a natural herbs. Nature intervening here. Interrupting that cycle of dysfunction or the healing cycle. Inflammation is part of healing, but if you are chronically inflamed, then that is, again, that is the cycle for which then needs to be interrupted.


Janelle: Yeah. And how do you go about determining which Dit Da Jow to use on a client? Like, for example, I have a lot of tension in my upper back and, you know, just knots and tension, like I said. And so do you have to go through, like, an analysis of the person and what's causing that root problem?


Jason: Yes, yes, yes, of course. Yeah. The specificity is absolutely mission critical. We all have different status of our conditions, okay? But, generally speaking, and again, I was actually on Plum Dragon's website today. And how Lisa has elaborated, and your team elaborated on the various types of injuries and how the Dit Da Jow is very specific as to what it is addressing, is on a whole another level of my area of expertise with regards to the products.


I use actually four of your products that I would say cover the needs of the range of dysfunction and issues that my clients have, okay? And that is Bruise Juice for acute contusions, okay? And then the Herbal Ice as a ice equivalent in a herbal form, okay? And then the Ancestor's Jow as the powerful, in my opinion, one of your guy's most potent products. I would be intrigued about whether Lisa or somebody else introduces me to a more powerful formula than what you offer than Ancestor's. I believe it's the most potent, okay?


And then Ho Family just seems to work as well and, again, for chronic conditioning of [inaudible 00:50:33] and ancestors regularly just to be able to work on myself. And reading on you guy's website how that conditions those tissues and sinews, and skin, and so on so forth to hold up to the rigors of even iron shirt and iron palm training. 


Janelle: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that's true. I mean, because it can help with any person's pain management. But like you said, it holds up to the rigors of the intense sparring and physical contact that martial artists engage in on a regular basis.


Jason: Yeah, in Shaolin, you know, I mean, I've literally seen footage of Shaolin where I mean, they're punching sand, okay? Bare fists. So for real, for real, for real, for real iron shirt. They're breaking spears off in their throat, okay? Spears tips off. Again, so these herbal formulas have existed for thousands of years. You know, here's a wonderful quote. To bring it back to quotes is, "If something is true, it lasts forever." And there's a reason that Dit Da Jow has been around because it has been refined over the centuries to do precisely what we need it to do.


Janelle: Yeah, that's so true. I love that. And I'm so grateful that I had the opportunity to speak with you today. And how can listeners get in touch with you if they want to follow up with you or have additional questions?


Jason: So my website is www.tranquilheartenterprise.com. And those words are spelled out. And so anyone can find my contact information, my address, contact form, and I would just love to hear from everyone in regards to all things that we discussed and any inquiry that they have in regards to what it is that perhaps I may be able to assist them.


Janelle: Yeah. Yeah, that's great. And what we'll do is we'll put that link on our show notes, so that people can find you from our page as well.


Jason: Love it.


Janelle: Yeah. So thank you, again, for joining us, and we hope that our listeners will join us for another podcast coming up soon. Thank you.


Jason: Yes, joyful honor. Bye.


Janelle: And thanks to all our listeners for joining us today. Be sure to visit us at plumdragonherbs.com. And if you liked the show, be sure to leave a comment on our YouTube channel. Until next time.